Forum Discussion

AlexS_yb

Cirrocumulus

Dec 30, 2022

OAuth server setup Q - APM

auth.demo.com >> APM OAuth server

res.demo.com >> APM Client / resource OAuth server

res.demo.com/protectedurl >> OAuth protected resource

So when you go to res.demo.com/protectedurl you get redirected to auth.demo.com and you get asked to log in

So lets ay I have my OAuth tokens set to 20min refresh max and 5 min access token life

and lets say I have APM session inactivity on auth.demo.com set to 30min.

So once I have gone to auth.demo.com recieved my token and using it now on res.demo.com

I would expect every 5min the access token is refreshed

At 20min a redirect back to auth.demo.com would happen to get a new refresh token

I would expect that my APM session on auth.demo.com would still exist its only been 20min and inactivity is set to 30min.

But no that doesn't happen, it seems like a OAuth authorisation request terminates your APM session on auth.demo.com (also changes your cookies for auth.demo.com) so you don't have a valid APM session - so that means every 30 min you have to log back in.

How do you stop that, I am happy that if they are doing stuff on res.demo.com continiously that they shouldn't have to log back in.

But I also want those 5min and 20 min check in's so I can block at that spot.

7 Replies

Leslie_Hubertus
Ret. Employee
Jan 05, 2023
Hey AlexS_yb - it looks like your post might not have gotten an answer because of the holiday lull in traffic. I've asked one of my teammates to take a look and see if they can help you out, and will also feature this in this week's Highlights article to get more eyes on it.
AubreyKingF5
Moderator
Jan 06, 2023
If they've reproduced an error, they'll kick that up to product.
- AlexS_yb
  Cirrocumulus
  Jan 06, 2023
  well this is the question is that an error, more research I do seems to suggest its not ...
AlexS_yb
Cirrocumulus
Jan 08, 2023
Going to add some more to this.
The AIM build a SSO framework to protect mulitple uri on different VS with a single OAuth server.
I wanted the auth server (OAuth server) to be the place people login and also the place that OAuth tokens are generated.

It seems though that the way F5 have implemented this that tokens can only be issued via a special APM mode oauth_mode and seems like you can't have 2 APM sessions going at the same time.

So example johny goes to auth logins and setups a APM session - lets say inactivity is set to 1 hour.
Johny goes to https://res1/protectedurl this is protected by OAuth client (VPE). so res1 does a redirect to auth
Now auth realises this is a OAuth /authorise call and terminates the APM session (the login session johnny had) and will ask johny to login again ! thats not good. Because OAuth access token is set to max life 15min - this will happen every 15 min ! even worse.
The VPE object OAuth authorisation can't be created in a per request access policy - or atleast I have failed to do it and this seems to be the problem.

Because I want 1 VS to be auth and login I'm trying to figure out how to do it.
I thought why not put all of the OAuth onto another VS and use a pool to access it so that
https://auth -> VS
https://auth/<anything Oauth> -> p_OAuth server
the hope is here I can generate new mrh session token for the new VS and the pool will hide it away from the user
but how do I get the user info / user session from the auth VS to the OAuth vs - maybe a header with the session id. if the VS's are int he same partition they can access each others sessions !

seems overly complicated - any thoughts ??
- AubreyKingF5
  Moderator
  Jan 10, 2023
  I've had similar issues in the past. I'm trying to get a couple of other eyes on this, too..
- Lucas_Thompson
  Employee
  Jan 27, 2023
  As you've discovered, APM acting as OAuth AS deletes the user session immediately upon issuing a token. This isn't ideal if you want to keep the session alive doing multiple use cases.
  
  APM as SAML IdP does not have this behavior. You may be better off using SAML. Another benefit of SAML is that you can pass more claims data in the assertion.
  - AlexS_yb
    Cirrocumulus
    Jan 28, 2023
    Hi
    
    Yes seems like a bad design from F5 on this.
    Yes i have saml in the mix already - but ... not good for scripting - saml by default uses posts.
    there is artifacting binding - which uses a get and allow the SP to talk to the IDP directly by passing the client - but the F5 implementation doesn't work
    I explained a potential work around with the OAuth apm being on a VS by itself behind the main VS - you would have to save and restore the APM tokens. Too much hard work for me right now 🙂

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based change management","id":"message:37596","entityType":"FORUM_TOPIC","eventPath":"category:Forums/community:zihoc95639board:TechnicalForum/message:37596","revisionNum":1,"repliesCount":4,"author":{"__ref":"User:user:14739"},"depth":0,"hasGivenKudo":false,"board":{"__ref":"Forum:board:TechnicalForum"},"conversation":{"__ref":"Conversation:conversation:37596"},"readOnly":false,"editFrozen":false,"showMoveIndicator":false,"moderationData":{"__ref":"ModerationData:moderation_data:37596"},"body":"Hi All,

I'm working in an environment that is trying to solve a rather difficult change control problem.

We're building a system that uses iRules and external data groups to provide some pretty cool content based routing. That's all fine and the iRules are under control but now to solve the change management process.

The issue is, how to change multiple iRules, and data groups in a way that all of the changes get applied at the same time; preferably in an automated way.

My first thought was of course iControl, and I noticed both the the iControl::System::ConfigSync::upload_file which should give me the ability to upload my external datagroup files and also the iControl::Management::ChangeControl objects that came about in 9.4.0. Problem is I'm not sure of the formatting of the configuration objects that need to be used in the ChangeControl::put_config command and also whether or not we can apply multiple changes simultaniously with these commands.

Any help or suggestions would be appreciated.

","body@stringLength":"1279","rawBody":"Hi All,

I'm working in an environment that is trying to solve a rather difficult change control problem.

The issue is, how to change multiple iRules, and data groups in a way that all of the changes get applied at the same time; preferably in an automated way.

Any help or suggestions would be appreciated.

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As AI and data-driven workloads grow, enterprises need scalable, high-performance, and resilient storage. Dell ObjectScale delivers with its cloud-native, S3-compatible design, ideal for AI/ML and analytics. F5 BIG-IP LTM and DNS enhance ObjectScale by providing intelligent traffic management and global load balancing—ensuring consistent performance and availability across distributed environments. This article introduces Dell ObjectScale and its integration with F5 solutions for advanced use cases.

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See how F5 AI Assistant for BIG-IP accelerates the creation of new iRules and simplifies their management, making traffic management and security more accessible and efficient than ever before.

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A group in my company has built a complete infrastructure for managing and publishing LTM and GTM configuration change control using iControl and a database for medium and enterprise level F5 environments. The tool allows you to enforce business logic in a more granular way than is possible in the F5 GUI.

If you're interested in more information, I can put you in touch with one of the developers. You can email me at \"aaron dot hooley at integralis dot com\" or check our site, http://www.integralis.co.uk/IntegralisServices/Consulting/Page-16151/AdvancedCustomisationEngineering.html.

Aaron","body@stripHtml({\"removeProcessingText\":false,\"removeSpoilerMarkup\":false,\"removeTocMarkup\":false,\"truncateLength\":200})@stringLength":"213","kudosSumWeight":0,"repliesCount":0,"postTime":"2009-07-07T02:13:36.000-07:00","lastPublishTime":"2009-07-07T02:13:36.000-07:00","metrics":{"__typename":"MessageMetrics","views":244},"visibilityScope":"PUBLIC","placeholder":false,"showMoveIndicator":false,"originalMessageForPlaceholder":null,"isEscalated":null,"solution":false,"replies":{"__typename":"MessageConnection","pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null},"edges":[]},"customFields":[],"attachments":{"__typename":"AttachmentConnection","edges":[],"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}}},"AssociatedImage:{\"url\":\"https://community.f5.com/t5/s/zihoc95639/images/cmstMS01bkFrOTY\"}":{"__typename":"AssociatedImage","url":"https://community.f5.com/t5/s/zihoc95639/images/cmstMS01bkFrOTY","height":0,"width":0,"mimeType":"image/svg+xml"},"Rank:rank:1":{"__typename":"Rank","id":"rank:1","position":1,"name":"Admin","color":"C20025","icon":{"__ref":"AssociatedImage:{\"url\":\"https://community.f5.com/t5/s/zihoc95639/images/cmstMS01bkFrOTY\"}"},"rankStyle":"FILLED"},"User:user:51154":{"__typename":"User","id":"user:51154","uid":51154,"login":"JRahm","biography":null,"registrationData":{"__typename":"RegistrationData","status":null,"registrationTime":"2005-01-20T00:00:00.000-08:00"},"deleted":false,"email":"","avatar":{"__typename":"UserAvatar","url":"https://community.f5.com/t5/s/zihoc95639/images/dS01MTE1NC1uYzdSVFk?image-coordinates=0%2C0%2C1067%2C1067"},"rank":{"__ref":"Rank:rank:1"},"entityType":"USER","eventPath":"community:zihoc95639/user:51154"},"ModerationData:moderation_data:37598":{"__typename":"ModerationData","id":"moderation_data:37598","status":"APPROVED","rejectReason":null,"isReportedAbuse":false,"rejectUser":null,"rejectTime":null,"rejectActorType":null},"ForumReplyMessage:message:37598":{"__typename":"ForumReplyMessage","author":{"__ref":"User:user:51154"},"id":"message:37598","entityType":"FORUM_REPLY","eventPath":"category:Forums/community:zihoc95639board:TechnicalForum/message:37596/message:37598","revisionNum":1,"uid":37598,"depth":1,"hasGivenKudo":false,"subscribed":false,"board":{"__ref":"Forum:board:TechnicalForum"},"parent":{"__ref":"ForumTopicMessage:message:37596"},"conversation":{"__ref":"Conversation:conversation:37596"},"subject":"Re: iControl based change management","moderationData":{"__ref":"ModerationData:moderation_data:37598"},"body":"If you have v10, tmsh offers batch processing of configuration changes, so not only do they all change at the same time, but no changes are made unless they all are successful. I did a write up on this functionality for GTM:

v.10 - Working the GTM Command Line Interface Click here","body@stripHtml({\"removeProcessingText\":false,\"removeSpoilerMarkup\":false,\"removeTocMarkup\":false,\"truncateLength\":200})@stringLength":"203","kudosSumWeight":0,"repliesCount":0,"postTime":"2009-07-07T05:24:47.000-07:00","lastPublishTime":"2009-07-07T05:24:47.000-07:00","metrics":{"__typename":"MessageMetrics","views":245},"visibilityScope":"PUBLIC","placeholder":false,"showMoveIndicator":false,"originalMessageForPlaceholder":null,"isEscalated":null,"solution":false,"replies":{"__typename":"MessageConnection","pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null},"edges":[]},"customFields":[],"attachments":{"__typename":"AttachmentConnection","edges":[],"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}}},"User:user:106220":{"__typename":"User","id":"user:106220","uid":106220,"login":"Joe_Pruitt","biography":null,"registrationData":{"__typename":"RegistrationData","status":null,"registrationTime":"2004-09-22T01:00:00.000-07:00"},"deleted":false,"email":"","avatar":{"__typename":"UserAvatar","url":"https://community.f5.com/t5/s/zihoc95639/images/dS0xMDYyMjAtUU1TTFdB?image-coordinates=0%2C0%2C1000%2C1000"},"rank":null,"entityType":"USER","eventPath":"community:zihoc95639/user:106220"},"ModerationData:moderation_data:37599":{"__typename":"ModerationData","id":"moderation_data:37599","status":"APPROVED","rejectReason":null,"isReportedAbuse":false,"rejectUser":null,"rejectTime":null,"rejectActorType":null},"ForumReplyMessage:message:37599":{"__typename":"ForumReplyMessage","author":{"__ref":"User:user:106220"},"id":"message:37599","entityType":"FORUM_REPLY","eventPath":"category:Forums/community:zihoc95639board:TechnicalForum/message:37596/message:37599","revisionNum":1,"uid":37599,"depth":1,"hasGivenKudo":false,"subscribed":false,"board":{"__ref":"Forum:board:TechnicalForum"},"parent":{"__ref":"ForumTopicMessage:message:37596"},"conversation":{"__ref":"Conversation:conversation:37596"},"subject":"Re: iControl based change management","moderationData":{"__ref":"ModerationData:moderation_data:37599"},"body":"The ChangeControl methods were introduced for Enterprise Manager and I honestly don't even know how to use them so I wouldn't recommend going down that route. If you are only concerned with rules and data groups and all the data groups are external, you can upload the external groups first which won't trigger an action since they are only reloaded at configuration time. Setting the file mode on the external class with the LocalLB.Class.set_external_class_file_mode method will trigger a reload of the file. Then you can update all the iRules in one shot with a single call to LocalLB.Rule.modify_rule. You will have an instant between when the new class files are available and using the old iRules though. The only way to really go around this is to edit the configs by hand and issue a \"b load\" (or with tmsh on v10).

Hope this helps...

-Joe","body@stripHtml({\"removeProcessingText\":false,\"removeSpoilerMarkup\":false,\"removeTocMarkup\":false,\"truncateLength\":200})@stringLength":"203","kudosSumWeight":0,"repliesCount":0,"postTime":"2009-07-07T14:43:18.000-07:00","lastPublishTime":"2009-07-07T14:43:18.000-07:00","metrics":{"__typename":"MessageMetrics","views":245},"visibilityScope":"PUBLIC","placeholder":false,"showMoveIndicator":false,"originalMessageForPlaceholder":null,"isEscalated":null,"solution":false,"replies":{"__typename":"MessageConnection","pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null},"edges":[]},"customFields":[],"attachments":{"__typename":"AttachmentConnection","edges":[],"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}}},"Rank:rank:47":{"__typename":"Rank","id":"rank:47","position":5,"name":"Historic F5 Account","color":"949494","icon":null,"rankStyle":"OUTLINE"},"User:user:50312":{"__typename":"User","id":"user:50312","uid":50312,"login":"Don_MacVittie_1","biography":null,"registrationData":{"__typename":"RegistrationData","status":null,"registrationTime":"2004-09-25T01:00:00.000-07:00"},"deleted":false,"email":"","avatar":{"__typename":"UserAvatar","url":"https://community.f5.com/t5/s/zihoc95639/m_assets/avatars/default/avatar-2.svg?time=0"},"rank":{"__ref":"Rank:rank:47"},"entityType":"USER","eventPath":"community:zihoc95639/user:50312"},"ModerationData:moderation_data:37600":{"__typename":"ModerationData","id":"moderation_data:37600","status":"APPROVED","rejectReason":null,"isReportedAbuse":false,"rejectUser":null,"rejectTime":null,"rejectActorType":null},"ForumReplyMessage:message:37600":{"__typename":"ForumReplyMessage","author":{"__ref":"User:user:50312"},"id":"message:37600","entityType":"FORUM_REPLY","eventPath":"category:Forums/community:zihoc95639board:TechnicalForum/message:37596/message:37600","revisionNum":1,"uid":37600,"depth":1,"hasGivenKudo":false,"subscribed":false,"board":{"__ref":"Forum:board:TechnicalForum"},"parent":{"__ref":"ForumTopicMessage:message:37596"},"conversation":{"__ref":"Conversation:conversation:37596"},"subject":"Re: iControl based change management","moderationData":{"__ref":"ModerationData:moderation_data:37600"},"body":"I have helped a customer do something similar to what you're trying to do, I know I'm late to this party (sorry!) but feel free to drop me a line if you're still working on it.

Don.","body@stripHtml({\"removeProcessingText\":false,\"removeSpoilerMarkup\":false,\"removeTocMarkup\":false,\"truncateLength\":200})@stringLength":"193","kudosSumWeight":0,"repliesCount":0,"postTime":"2009-09-01T10:54:59.000-07:00","lastPublishTime":"2009-09-01T10:54:59.000-07:00","metrics":{"__typename":"MessageMetrics","views":245},"visibilityScope":"PUBLIC","placeholder":false,"showMoveIndicator":false,"originalMessageForPlaceholder":null,"isEscalated":null,"solution":false,"replies":{"__typename":"MessageConnection","pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null},"edges":[]},"customFields":[],"attachments":{"__typename":"AttachmentConnection","edges":[],"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}}},"CachedAsset:text:en_US-components/community/NavbarDropdownToggle-1752674587378":{"__typename":"CachedAsset","id":"text:en_US-components/community/NavbarDropdownToggle-1752674587378","value":{"ariaLabelClosed":"Press the down arrow to open the menu"},"localOverride":false},"CachedAsset:text:en_US-components/messages/EscalatedMessageBanner-1752674587378":{"__typename":"CachedAsset","id":"text:en_US-components/messages/EscalatedMessageBanner-1752674587378","value":{"escalationMessage":"Escalated to Salesforce by {username} on {date}","viewDetails":"View Details","modalTitle":"Case Details","escalatedBy":"Escalated by: ","escalatedOn":"Escalated on: ","caseNumber":"Case Number: ","status":"Status: ","lastUpdateDate":"Last Update: ","automaticEscalation":"automatic escalation","anonymous":"Anonymous"},"localOverride":false},"CachedAsset:text:en_US-components/users/UserLink-1752674587378":{"__typename":"CachedAsset","id":"text:en_US-components/users/UserLink-1752674587378","value":{"authorName":"View Profile: {author}","anonymous":"Anonymous"},"localOverride":false},"CachedAsset:text:en_US-shared/client/components/users/UserRank-1752674587378":{"__typename":"CachedAsset","id":"text:en_US-shared/client/components/users/UserRank-1752674587378","value":{"rankName":"{rankName}","userRank":"Author rank {rankName}"},"localOverride":false},"CachedAsset:text:en_US-components/messages/MessageTime-1752674587378":{"__typename":"CachedAsset","id":"text:en_US-components/messages/MessageTime-1752674587378","value":{"postTime":"Published: {time}","lastPublishTime":"Last Update: {time}","conversation.lastPostingActivityTime":"Last posting activity time: {time}","conversation.lastPostTime":"Last post time: {time}","moderationData.rejectTime":"Rejected time: {time}"},"localOverride":false},"CachedAsset:text:en_US-components/messages/MessageSolvedBadge-1752674587378":{"__typename":"CachedAsset","id":"text:en_US-components/messages/MessageSolvedBadge-1752674587378","value":{"solved":"Solved"},"localOverride":false},"CachedAsset:text:en_US-components/messages/MessageSubject-1752674587378":{"__typename":"CachedAsset","id":"text:en_US-components/messages/MessageSubject-1752674587378","value":{"noSubject":"(no subject)"},"localOverride":false},"CachedAsset:text:en_US-components/messages/MessageBody-1752674587378":{"__typename":"CachedAsset","id":"text:en_US-components/messages/MessageBody-1752674587378","value":{"showMessageBody":"Show More","mentionsErrorTitle":"{mentionsType, select, board {Board} user {User} message {Message} other {}} No Longer Available","mentionsErrorMessage":"The {mentionsType} you are trying to view has been removed from the community.","videoProcessing":"Video is being processed. 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